Just to throw it out there, I got together with a girl wearing Chikara (although Chikara had always been hit and miss for me.)

She stayed even after Chikara ran out, in fact becoming closer and closer over time.

To any woman who shows a different attitude once there are no mones being worn - "wham bam thank you ma'am; the door's the wooden thing on the wall." I mean, you wouldn't consider such a person for a Long Term Relationship, would you?

Amen Kimo...fuck 'em and feed 'em donuts

(08-15-2015 10:28 AM)SuperJoy Wrote:  Ive never, and I mean a lots of never, had a women that didn't conform herself to me. Oh you like being fit and healthy... so do I (now). The only trouble is that they really don't and at some point this behavior will rear its ugly head. How is that any difference than losing a scent?

Agree, but there's no need to go tit-for-tat with women about who can be the most dishonest about their true selves! If a woman isn't really into fitness, you'd want to know early – ideally before you'd made any kind of long term investment in her (living together, getting married, buying a house, having kids etc – the things the OP wants). Similarly, it's in her interest, and your own, that you're being as close to your natural, sustainable self as possible.

(08-15-2015 10:28 AM)SuperJoy Wrote:  Not to mention that both men and women change on a weekly basis too boot... Neither of your 'mones signatures are going to be the same regardless of what you wear on a given day.

Again I agree, but I doubt our day to day variation is anything like the variance between artificial mones and no artificial mones. Despite taking a very active interest in testosterone optimization, I've never had the same effects from that as I have from slapping on some Scent of Eros and New Pheromone Additive.

(08-15-2015 10:28 AM)SuperJoy Wrote:  Play around with life... its only life. Short term. Grow some thick skin and when its time to move on...move on. Outcome independence has done nothing but improved my life for the better.

Agree to an extent, but there are levels to this. Until I met my present partner, I was into pick-up/game for many years. If a girl I met didn't like me, I didn't give a shit. When I was at the top of my game (and this was without mones) I could (and often did) go on a date with a different girl every night of the week – and didn't give the slightest damn if one of those girls didn't like me. Those are your classic examples of outcome independence.

But once you've invested a lot time, effort, money and genetic material, then it's a different matter. I think, you actually do need to care what happens. If you look at your wife and kid and go “I don't give a damn” you've extrapolated too far from the point your guru was making!

(08-15-2015 4:53 PM)kimosabe Wrote:  Just to throw it out there, I got together with a girl wearing Chikara (although Chikara had always been hit and miss for me.)

She stayed even after Chikara ran out, in fact becoming closer and closer over time.

I knew there'd be someone who had actually done it Good for you, but I still think there's a greater risk when you start like that.

(08-15-2015 4:53 PM)kimosabe Wrote:  To any woman who shows a different attitude once there are no mones being worn - "wham bam thank you ma'am; the door's the wooden thing on the wall." I mean, you wouldn't consider such a person for a Long Term Relationship, would you?

Agree, but I want to know that as early as possible, which is why I didn't wear any mones when I was properly dating (as opposed to looking for fuck buddies etc). I don't care if I spend a date with someone who didn't like me without pheromones, but I wouldn't want to find that out much further down the line – especially if I was in the OP's situation where he wants to find someone to settle down with.

^Sure, I'd like to know as early as possible also.

Which is why I'd meet her without mones at times during the dating stage and see how she responds. If she responds well, then we can take things further. Otherwise, standard reply is in my earlier post.

I do agree with Superjoy though, in that mones add to (and accentuate part of) your own signature. When synthetic mones are taken away, the base natural signature still remains.

You also need to consider that a woman's feelings towards you are going to change drastically through her cycle. Plus the proven connection between hormonal birth control and pheromone response.

I think most women will be happy if they have passionate emotions for you once or twice a month.

(08-15-2015 9:21 PM)kimosabe Wrote:  ^Sure, I'd like to know as early as possible also.

Which is why I'd meet her without mones at times during the dating stage and see how she responds. If she responds well, then we can take things further. Otherwise, standard reply is in my earlier post.

Yep, I think if you do start things with mones, it would be a good to take a break and see how she reacts when you don't have them on.

(08-15-2015 9:21 PM)kimosabe Wrote:  I do agree with Superjoy though, in that mones add to (and accentuate part of) your own signature. When synthetic mones are taken away, the base natural signature still remains.

It's true that your natural signature will not be changed by the addition of synthetics - but there's a big difference between what your natural signature actually is, and the apparent signature that she perceives once synthetics are added. All she gets is your phero cloud of both combined with no way of disaggregating that.

If you add synthetics, both the level of mones and the ratio between the different mones in your apparent signature can be dramatically different compared to your natural signature. She therefore has absolutely no way of knowing what your natural signature is until you cease with the synthetics. Although it is possible that she'll like them both - there is no guarantee she will.

To go back to my simplified example with 'none, 'nol and 'Androsterone - your natural signature may be 4,2,5 without synthetics - but if you say added a 6,5,1 product, then your apparent signature would become 10,7,6. Both the level and ratio are different and there's no way of her brain knowing what the natural signature is until the synthetics disappear.

One element is missing here and that's the potentially profound impact mones have on the wearer. Many experienced users can channel effects...this is me on Xist, me on Core, SOB etc.. Beyond that new ingrained behaviors can evolve that are congruent with a repetitive "artificial" signature...in effect over time you can become a hybrid of your natural mind set and your new mone altered mindset.

A product like BW at lower doses (1-3 drops) is ideal for this, I second getting Xist BTW....great mix with BW at 2d/1x or 3d/2x...

(08-16-2015 9:31 AM)DWR Wrote:  One element is missing here and that's the potentially profound impact mones have on the wearer. Many experienced users can channel effects...this is me on Xist, me on Core, SOB etc.. Beyond that new ingrained behaviors can evolve that are congruent with a repetitive "artificial" signature...in effect over time you can become a hybrid of your natural mind set and your new mone altered mindset.

A product like BW at lower doses (1-3 drops) is ideal for this, I second getting Xist BTW....great mix with BW at 2d/1x or 3d/2x...

One of the results I'm getting from mones is integrating the self-effects that I like into myself. Like the mones are the way to train those effects and eventually you'll just have them as part of yourself.

Just to throw in a little more fuel to the fire; after a baby things get really weird. Her hormones will be screwed for months, sometimes years...

This is my main reason for using mones, after the second kid I want some of the spark back; until she can get her mojo back naturally.

(08-16-2015 9:39 AM)Mr. E Wrote:  One of the results I'm getting from mones is integrating the self-effects that I like into myself. Like the mones are the way to train those effects and eventually you'll just have them as part of yourself.

I concur