And the repored weightt gains on the internet is it because of eating more or just beceause of the molecule?

Estrogenic effects means it activates the estrogen receptor (though some people don't believe in such a thing) and causes the same effects as having high estrogen in your blood or cells.

The weight gain is from water retention, fat gain, increased appetite, and lowered metabolism.

Methoxyestratetraenone may be useful in levels low enough to make this a non-issue, depending on your perspective.

(04-06-2016 10:58 AM)NP17 Wrote:  Estrogenic effects means it activates the estrogen receptor (though some people don't believe in such a thing) and causes the same effects as having high estrogen in your blood or cells.

The weight gain is from water retention, fat gain, increased appetite, and lowered metabolism.

Methoxyestratetraenone may be useful in levels low enough to make this a non-issue, depending on your perspective.

The description of receptor activation is way to broadly, there are countless variables depending on the agonist. Only because one substance activates a rececptor doesn't mean it will have the same results as another, even similar substance activates it.

Moreover, most of the times users on here confuse or equate what is known of the effects of the sex hormone ! Estradiol systemically in men with suspected, hypothetical effects of steroids ! like Estratetraenol, of which no estrogenic effects are described in medical literature btw.

This whole EST, Methoxyestratetraenone /nol discussion and pseudoscientific, even ridiculous claims about their systemical estrogenic effects completely took on a life of it's own - claims by untrained people. The lowest point of this discussion was the equaltion of Hedione with EST and thereby with having estrogenic effects - notwithstanding high quality research given not the slightest indication of it and the pheromonal properties researched and proven to have the contrary effects.

(04-06-2016 12:54 PM)GoergeFocky Wrote:  The description of receptor activation is way to broadly, there are countless variables depending on the agonist. Only because one substance activates a rececptor doesn't mean it will have the same results as another, even similar substance activates it.

Moreover, most of the times users on here confuse or equate what is known of the effects of the sex hormone ! Estradiol systemically in men with suspected, hypothetical effects of steroids ! like Estratetraenol, of which no estrogenic effects are described in medical literature btw.

This whole EST, Methoxyestratetraenone /nol discussion and pseudoscientific, even ridiculous claims about their systemical estrogenic effects completely took on a life of it's own - claims by untrained people. The lowest point of this discussion was the equaltion of Hedione with EST and thereby with having estrogenic effects - notwithstanding high quality research given not the slightest indication of it and the pheromonal properties researched and proven to have the contrary effects.

I'm not 100% getting what your saying, you mean that it's not likely to gain weight with it? And what about the whole cancer thing?

(04-06-2016 2:59 PM)kerno Wrote:  I'm not 100% getting what your saying, you mean that it's not likely to gain weight with it? And what about the whole cancer thing?

He's saying that claims one way or another are unsubstantiated. This is true. From my own experiences, I would consider EST just estrogenic enough to ruin a mix it's used in (though many do prefer what EST brings to the table). I'm not so convinced it would have any physiological consequences at any dose it's used at.

Methoxyestratetraenone is one of the most reported-on molecules out there. With over a decade of use, not a single report of cancer cropped up. I'm unconvinced this is a possibility at such low doses. As to the physiological consequences? I've only seen these reported in combination with other problematic molecules. Androstadienone and EST in this case.

As for hedione? I'm not swayed either way. It could very well be mildly estrogenic with a little too much pushing things over the edge. Jasmine, after all (which hedione was originally derived from), is mildly estrogenic (can't find any sources for this at the moment, so take that with a huge grain of salt).

I agree that too much of those can ruin a mix intenden to signal alpha-masculinity, and I don't find Hedione a useful phero.

"Estrogenic" I just find to be an unappropriate and misleading wording, it's physiological meaning is well definend medical term and there are zero indictaions that EST, Methoxyestratetraenone , Meo-Nol or Hedione act estrogenic when used in mcg ranges as an aerosol.