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+--- Thread: Fear and Excitement are similiar (/Thread-Fear-and-Excitement-are-similiar)
Fear and Excitement are similiar - metaltree - 11-03-2016 1:57 PM
Lately I've been reading that fear and excitement involve the exact same chemicals in the body. It is what we do with our mind that makes the two emotions different.
Has anyone in this forum been able to change their mental focus in such a way where they have been able to transform fear/anxiety into excitement?
This post is in the club house for off topic conversations but I do have a pheromone need. When I apply Androstenone I feel strong butterflies in my stomach and I feel very anxious and unsettled. I'm wondering if there is a way that I can use my mind to transform this anxious feeling into a feeling of excitement and pleasure.
RE: Fear and Excitement are similiar - BarefootOxford - 11-03-2016 2:17 PM
(11-03-2016 1:57 PM)metaltree Wrote: Lately I've been reading that fear and excitement involve the exact same chemicals in the body. It is what we do with our mind that makes the two emotions different.
Has anyone in this forum been able to change their mental focus in such a way where they have been able to transform fear/anxiety into excitement?
This post is in the club house for off topic conversations but I do have a pheromone need. When I apply Androstenone I feel strong butterflies in my stomach and I feel very anxious and unsettled. I'm wondering if there is a way that I can use my mind to transform this anxious feeling into a feeling of excitement and pleasure.
If you enjoy rollercoasters, you've experienced this. The key is to reframe the experience consciously, similar to fake-it-until-you-make-it. It is a skill that you must learn if you want to become good at it, and remember that you are currently unconsciously incompetent at it, and you will progress through conscious incompetence, conscious competence, and eventually unconscious competence (where you just do it).
This will take a very long time and a lot of work to become unconsciously competent at a skill like this one.
A tactic that is helpful in this is to use the property expression or body language being inextricably linked to emotional state. Similarly to how adopting an alpha male stance can improve your feelings of empowerment and confidence, adopting an expression and stance of being excited should help you feel more excited and less anxious.
RE: Fear and Excitement are similiar - Spars - 11-03-2016 2:30 PM
Barefoot! Nice explanation!
Tried to rep it, but I gotta spread the love before I rep you again!
For myself, this occurs when a big event is coming and there are preparations that need to be made. The calm confidence only occurs when my appetite for success is fulfilled. i.e., the job is done to my standards and expectations. The butterflies and anxiousness fall away and with a sigh of relief, I'm unstoppable and excited to reap the rewards of my success.
I appreciate you putting this up. It helped me connect myself and better understand. Obviously, the key to me is to channel my nervousness or anxiety to an outlet. I experience a similar effect after a big lift. I tend to do my best work when this event occurs and the confidence is a sweet high that I try to remember.
RE: Fear and Excitement are similiar - RussianWolf - 11-03-2016 6:17 PM
Maybe work out during that time and use it to your advantage. Just my two cents
RE: Fear and Excitement are similiar - metaltree - 11-04-2016 12:10 PM
I have been doing more research into this concept and the key seeme to be "mindfulness". Being in the present moment allows you to accept the butterflies in your stomach while bypassing any negative intrepetations. Then you can experience the feeling without thinking of it as fear.
RE: Fear and Excitement are similiar - BarefootOxford - 11-04-2016 1:43 PM
(11-03-2016 2:30 PM)Spars Wrote: Barefoot! Nice explanation!
Tried to rep it, but I gotta spread the love before I rep you again!
For myself, this occurs when a big event is coming and there are preparations that need to be made. The calm confidence only occurs when my appetite for success is fulfilled. i.e., the job is done to my standards and expectations. The butterflies and anxiousness fall away and with a sigh of relief, I'm unstoppable and excited to reap the rewards of my success.
I appreciate you putting this up. It helped me connect myself and better understand. Obviously, the key to me is to channel my nervousness or anxiety to an outlet. I experience a similar effect after a big lift. I tend to do my best work when this event occurs and the confidence is a sweet high that I try to remember.
Glad I could help.
(11-03-2016 6:17 PM)RussianWolf Wrote: Maybe work out during that time and use it to your advantage. Just my two cents
This is very good, and works well for a friend of mine. He's found that he better enters flow after he's discharged the energy in his body. So he wakes early, hits the iron, then goes and works on his brain-driven projects.
RE: Fear and Excitement are similiar - kalpan56 - 11-05-2016 5:29 AM
Excitement and fear clouds mind. You need to handle both the emotions properly. The ways to do so:
Meditation
PEAT by Zivorad Slavanski
Subliminal ( You should make your own)
Patience is the key to handle both of them.
RE: Fear and Excitement are similiar - duker - 11-09-2016 4:42 AM
They are two different terms.
RE: Fear and Excitement are similiar - BarefootOxford - 11-09-2016 12:43 PM
(11-09-2016 4:42 AM)duker Wrote: They are two different terms.
Come on, that's a low-effort, low-content reply. Of COURSE they're two different terms. We're discussing their relationship and how to manage them. I'm not going to torch you, here, but you've got to step up your game and make better posts than this or you're not going to last here. To me, this looks like a quick post so you can get your five and move up to the next level.
RE: Fear and Excitement are similiar - GoergeFocky - 11-09-2016 12:47 PM
It's like when Trump is President-elect. One half of Americans ae excited, the other half are afraid ... Only a bad joke of course, I hope for the great USA that what seems a grave division from afar can be overcome in everyday life at least. I'd liked to see a Prsident Sanders, but I personally and from a european security perspective prefer Trump over Clinton any day, if anyone wans to know.
I disagree that only becuase the same endogenous substances are involved you would can call fear and excitement the same, or that they are the same - they are not and there are still vast physiological differences between the two states, and the moment these very physiological settings that are fear or excitement, the very moment you feel either one of these emotions, you cannot simply transform them by being conscious or mindful of them. When it happened, it happened, but mindfulness will allow you to control both states better and initiate a change.
And as a crass counterexample: The growth of some cancers involves the same endogenous substances as the growth of other benigne tissue. Are they the same?
Oxytocin is involved in love and hate, as is dopamine, serotonin in sadness and contentment, the list is endless.
RE: Fear and Excitement are similiar - BarefootOxford - 11-09-2016 12:59 PM
(11-09-2016 12:47 PM)GoergeFocky Wrote: I disagree that only becuase the same endogenous substances are involved you would can call fear and excitement the same, or that they are the same - they are not and there are still vast physiological differences between the two states, and the moment these very physiological settings that are fear or excitement, the very moment you feel either one of these emotions, you cannot simply transform them by being conscious or mindful of them. When it happened, it happened, but mindfulness will allow you to control both states better and initiate a change.
I may be misunderstanding your argument, so let me know if I am arguing against the wrong points.
I agree that fear and excitement are different, and that the physiological differences prove this out. However, when we look at it systematically, the situation begins with a stimulus. In my example above, we have a roller coaster. Generally, no one rides a roller coaster with no reaction. Some experience fear, and others excitement. The local inputs are all the same, and it is the individual's reaction to the stimuli which determines which state they enter. Other similar examples would be public speaking, approaching a beautiful woman, or parachuting.
RE: Fear and Excitement are similiar - GoergeFocky - 11-10-2016 6:00 AM
Certainly. The same situation/stimulus causes fear or excitement in any individual. I wanted to negate the claim that becuase the same endogneous substances are involved these emotions are a sort of an interchangable power, like in thermodynamics, that can be transformed by will alone. It's not the case - as your examples suggest: You are afraid or you are excited - if one could measure or compare every physilogical action, firing of neurons, substances being produced/reduced and so on .. we would find that there are the same substances involved but in very different quantities and mechanism. Contant fear will shrink your brain and kill you, excitement will be beneficial for a long while. Di- and Eustress respectively, broadly put.
I don't know where MetalTree read that stuff, but those are the popular- or better pseudoscientif stuff you find in any sort of magazines, written by authors that are untrained in the field.
RE: Fear and Excitement are similiar - BarefootOxford - 11-10-2016 11:30 AM
Then what explains the transformation of reaction in long-time sufferers of fears? Overcoming fear of rollercoasters (I did that), parachuting, public speaking, spiders, heights, etc. I have trouble agreeing with the theory that "you get used to it" because for some, the fear is present for many years until they consciously exercise their will to change the reaction.
RE: Fear and Excitement are similiar - GoergeFocky - 11-11-2016 1:12 AM
Some coping mechanism - if the individual is resilient enough or outside factors that caused a chronic negatve situation change for the better.
DHEA is a good example and phero-related. In patients with chronic major depression that managed remission, DHEA levels are elevated, cortisol down. DHEA is a major player in reducing cortiosol levels. High DHEA also leads to a modulation of neurons and glia-cells and changes the connection between the amygdala and the hippocampus as well as modulating the emotional impact of memory, leading in the long run to a normalization of DHEA/cortisol levels.
In other individuals, this coping mechanism fails. DHEA stays up, cortisol down, leadig to anhedonia and loss of motivation, changing the brain and subsequent physiological parameters for the worse.
It depends on your physiological "abilities" and outside factors if you would cope wit chronic stress or fear or if you get impaired by it.
To overcome some minor anxiety like fear of a rollercoaster it takes reflection and the example sof others. Someday you sit at home thnking: "next time I'm at Kiddyland I'll ride that coaster, everyone does, can't be that terrible" and if you do and do again you break the fear-pattern. But that indicates that something else has also changed in you, most probably in your age, you simply grow up which corellates with endocrine and neuroendocrine changes. As we grow up we face and manage situations that we could not before, like going to school first time unattended or making a long train ride. It's normal, not something extraordinary - and we feel good afterwards, turning dis- in eustress. But still, fear and excitement are not the same and that there are the same substances at play does not mean that it is guranteed to overcome fear. It's a banality, stating that there are the same substances involve, it's the nature of things
RE: Fear and Excitement are similiar - BarefootOxford - 11-11-2016 10:04 AM
Thank you for the explanation.
RE: Fear and Excitement are similiar - Alphonse - 11-11-2016 11:14 AM
Best way to turn fear into excitement I've found is graded exposure. Talk to enough women whilst constantly upping the escalation, and your approach anxiety will eventually turn into excitement as you overcome your inhibitions.
There's a great book called The Confidence Gap by Russ Harris if anyone wants to explore how mindfulness and a little rational emotive behaviour therapy can help in doing this, but the gist is as follows (these are my notes from the book).
THOUGHTS
The aim here is to be mindful of your thoughts and to defuse them. Not to challenge them while they are happening (you can do this later) not to try to replace them with positive thoughts (this won't work). Defusion works as follows:
1. Notice it
2. Name it
3. Neutralise it
Firstly you need to be aware of what is actually going on in your head. When you are experiencing high levels of anxiety, there is a series of thoughts that are taking place in your mind that are creating it. Naming this thought alows you to put a little emotional distance between you and these thoughts. E.g., "I am having the thought that I am going to die because my heart is beating so fast." Neutralising it means to simply let the thought go. Naming it is usually enough, but you can also repeat the thought back in a silly voice, imagine the volume diminishing into nothing, or, if your thoughts are more visual, visualise the picture fading out, getting smaller etc. It takes practice, but eventually it becomes as quick as thinking.
FEELINGS
The first thing to realise is that strong feelings are not dangerous, and you do not need to control what you feel to do what you want or to act on your values. Secondly, performance is not related to anxiety levels. Everyone in an exam hall is amxious, but those who do best are the ones who can engage fully in the task without being distracted by thoughts and feelings. The aim in this step is not to try to get rid of unpleasant feelings but to accomodate them. The steps are as follows
N - Notice feelings
A - Acknowledge
M - Make space
E - Expand awareness
1. Notice where fear/feeling shows up in body. If it's a dropping feeling in the pit of your stomach, what shape would it take if you outlined the borders of the feeling? How much space does it take up in yur body? Are there parts in the shape where the feelings are more dense than others? The feelings might not disappear completely, but your curiosity and open engagement will help to reduce them.
2. Acknowledge. Use simple self-talk. "Here is a feeling of fear" or "I notice a feeling of fear in my stomach" etc. THis is to realise you are not your feelings and that feelings are transient events.
3. Make room. Breathe into and around the feeling, psychologically open up and make room for it. Breath makes us present and drop the struggle of trying to change the feeling. This step is easier to do than it is to explain it, but it's the feelings equivalent of thought defusion - instead of believing that you are going to die because you're having palpitations, you realise this is just one thought in an ocean of thoughts (but for feelings).
4. Expand awareness. Continue to notice the feeling and simultaneously connect with the world around you. If you're scared of flying and the plane is just taking off, be aware of your fear and how it manifests in your body, but also be aware of how small the world looks as you ascend, the aftertaste of that overpriced sandwich you ate at the airport in your mouth, and most importantly, look around for any hot birds you might want to chat up while your waiting in the queue for passport control.
A
RE: Fear and Excitement are similiar - GoergeFocky - 11-11-2016 12:25 PM
Thanks for writing that down, soild advice
RE: Fear and Excitement are similiar - Shyguy1337 - 01-17-2017 9:38 PM
What if people are attracted to danger, because fear of danger causes excitement? What if people purposely make themselves appear more dangerous than they are to gain attraction? What if people project the opposite sex as more dangerous and scarier than they are to excite themselves?
RE: Fear and Excitement are similiar - MMM - 01-18-2017 1:04 PM
(11-03-2016 1:57 PM)metaltree Wrote: Lately I've been reading that fear and excitement involve the exact same chemicals in the body. It is what we do with our mind that makes the two emotions different.
Has anyone in this forum been able to change their mental focus in such a way where they have been able to transform fear/anxiety into excitement?
This post is in the club house for off topic conversations but I do have a pheromone need. When I apply Androstenone I feel strong butterflies in my stomach and I feel very anxious and unsettled. I'm wondering if there is a way that I can use my mind to transform this anxious feeling into a feeling of excitement and pleasure.
OFF TOPIC ... kinda sorta.
About 25 years ago, I ran across this very topic. So, I tested it out to get laid with ALL of my girlfriends every since. It worked 70 percent of the time.
Watched a horror movie while holding them close/cuddling/spooning.
Scared them right out of their panties! 
I said all that to say, YEP! Fear and Excitement --- YEP! THEY'RE VERY SIMILAR, IF NOT ONE IN THE SAME.
RE: Fear and Excitement are similiar - Vincent_Vega - 05-21-2017 5:43 AM
That would explain why BW can be so attractive. The fear molecule...
(01-17-2017 9:38 PM)Shyguy1337 Wrote: What if people are attracted to danger, because fear of danger causes excitement? What if people purposely make themselves appear more dangerous than they are to gain attraction? What if people project the opposite sex as more dangerous and scarier than they are to excite themselves?