(08-15-2011 8:20 PM)Fly So Hi Wrote:  Hey Johnny! Thanks so much for your insights!

Why do you say it is a bad boomerang?

EDIT: Do you mean it has that effect only when used solo?

I think Androstadienone has also a depressive boomerang effect on some girls as for some males. Maybe too overstimulating?

I see also negative effects if it is very hot, I mean the conversion effect Androstadienone /none.

I don't see this depressive effects with good and complex mixes, especially with EST.

(08-15-2011 8:21 PM)Injektilo Wrote:  Could you elaborate on what you mean by it being a negative boomerang later? Also, you're saying that estratetraenol alone or PEA alone are both better than androstadienone alone, but androstadienone with estratetraenol is better than just androstadienone? How does Androstadienone with Estratetraenol measure up against PEA alone? I have only recently begun to experiment with androstadienone in Steve's Cohesion mix (which has been working wonderfully for my purposes) and will be testing PEA as soon as I am back in town to check my mailbox. I wonder how androstadienone would pair with PEA.

I mean EST is much deeper, more emotional, high value and has a superb memory effect, but the effects are more subtle, below the radar level.

Both Androstadienone and EST alone don't do much. You need them in a mix. I think Instant Female Magic for example has a extra playfully, upbeat element.

PEA alone is much, nah, incredible stronger in you face as Androstadienone and EST together. I think it's the best and most effective of all single molecules, but the effects only holds 30 minutes and every other mix is dead and later, also if the PEA is gone away, is the mix much weaker or non-existent.

Androstadienone is great for bonding, comfort, space reducing, can be romantic and is a potent none buffer. You can see the potential together with none. Add a playfulyl element like DHEA and you have a simple and effective mix.

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(08-16-2011 2:15 AM)as33156 Wrote:  I go by results my friend. It has worked for me and does what i have described. I have not had any negative boomerang effects you speak of. So to me what you have said is gonzo. But they do say mones don't work the same for everyone.

Have you used Androstadienone alone? Dude, if Androstadienone works alone as you describe it then we need nothing more...

(08-16-2011 2:54 PM)JohnnyHard Wrote:  PEA alone is much, nah, incredible stronger in you face as Androstadienone and Estratetraenol together. I think it's the best and most effective of all single molecules, but the effects only holds 30 minutes and every other mix is dead and later, also if the PEA is gone away, is the mix much weaker or non-existent.

Johnny, I don't know if you've been reading the phenylethylamine thread, but Fly So High and I have a little theory about the nature of PEA and why it has such a short lifespan and tends to destroy other mixes. Check it out and maybe give your take on the matter.

http://pherotruth.org/Thread-Phenylethyl...7#pid23927

Sorry, i need to correct my previous statement. As what Johnny mentioned, I have not used est before by itself (i've used Androstadienone by itself) but i can feel its really obvious effects in a mix. I'll know more once my bottle of est from TP comes in.

http://www.pheromonetalk.com/mens-pherom...k-324.html

(08-16-2011 12:58 PM)as33156 Wrote:  What does Estratetraenol do?

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OK so with all the interesting effects of androstadienone that I've been reading for the past few months, this just struck me about the rate that it will convert to androstenol and androstanone ?

I've read that dienone will convert and be gone in some time around 30 minutes when sweating?

Will using a dimethicone barrier in the diluent/carrier mix prevent or slow the conversion of dienone?

http://www.pheromonetalk.com/mens-pherom...post392914

Any basis for this or timeline specifically? I'm wondering if having some single-molecule dienone to reapply will be a necessary thing if it is disappearing from my mixes so quickly.

Specifically, what is converting dienone to nol and none? Bacteria on the skin? Enzymes from apocrine glands?


More on this - air + catalyst (enzymes) causes nol to none conversion (still learning here for those that already know these things, please correct or add if something is awry)

http://love-scent.com/forum/showpost.php...ostcount=6
"Enzymes are, by definition, catalysts of the organic kind. So the conversion does take place on the skin. Not all portions of the skin will have the necessary enzymes and one would expect that they would be concentrated near the apocine glands. Likewise, bacteria can do this conversion (and others) using enzymes within the bacteria.

Therefore, where one applies exogenous pheromones could make a difference in what rate the conversion would happen. For example, Scent of Eros on the back of my hand results in a quick conversion to something that smells bad. Applying Scent of Eros to the underside of the wrists, the neck or the smooth side of the forearms does not cause this change in scent.


This is interesting - smelling earwax to determine natural pheromone secretion when taking supplements :
I have verified to myself many times that taking DHEA supplements (I\'d recommend only 5 or 10mg, the smallest available doses unless over 50. Prostate problems show up even at 15mg per day over long periods in some, higher risk of prostate cancer.)gives me the sweet stank of pheromones.
The nice thing is you get countless miscellaneous pheromones that don\'t come in bottles. Androstenedione works too --I can smell it on myself clearly -- but boosts the more specifically testosterone-related pheromones. As an experiment for the brave, try smelling your ear wax (a storehouse of human pheromones) before and one hour after taking such supplements. The effect is dramatic, for those of us that get their drama from ear wax.





BTW here is a good read on pheromones that touches on research on androstadienone a little old from 2004 but a nice read :

http://www.mindandmuscle.net/?q=articles...pheromones

http://www.mindandmuscle.net/?q=articles...eromones-2

A little quote about Androstadienone from my journal

Quote:About Androstadienone

Androstadienone is the best for making high status mixes less intimidating without losing their advantages! It makes them smooth and comforting in a really nice way! For me I've found 50 mcg are the best for use without Estratetraenol, with Estratetraenol I use about 75mcg Androstadienone to 50 Estratetraenol! I like Androstadienone one really much it's so comforting but also masculine without losing alphaness! I also noticed early "the fukushima effect" as Pago would call it, this means that men avoiding you! Not in that aggressive none way they just don't feel good around you! Estratetraenol is the best against th efukushima effekt

Interesting - a 2:3 ratio of Estratetraenol:Androstadienone

so with dbot's Eau Naturale mix, this would incorporate into the ratios as

6.6 Estratetraenol
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10 Androstadienone
4 Androstenol (3-Alpha)
1 Androstenol (3-Beta)
1 Androstenone
1 Androsterone
2 Androstadienol (5,16-3b)
1 DHEAS

I read that the average man produces/excretes to the skin over 1000mcg of Androstadienone per day!

That is a huge amount. More than the other big 3, I'll try to find the post where I read it and reference this.

So it boggles me about how Androstadienone can be depressing, seeing how men churn it out in such high amounts every day. If you get get a whole bunch of guys together we should all break down and cry, not play sports. Wait, this could be a correlary, maybe those are the guys that Androstadienone causes depression in, the ones who are also have a natural aversion to sports/locker rooms/ other guys.

I'm not sure if I was joking about that or not (the sports thing).

Thanks for the info.

You may well be right, but i think that 1mg Androstadienone per day is excreted throughout the whole body, not 500mcg each side of your neck, right "under your nose" to smell it. Not to mention we take shower, use perfumes, cover ourselves with clothes and etc.

Now speaking by experience, as far as "guys with aversion to sports and locker rooms" goes, i was just that type of socially awkward guy in high school, and i'm pretty sure it's a matter of self-confidence and social acceptance, rather than hormones or pheromones related.

(03-19-2012 2:48 PM)dexter Wrote:  I read that the average man produces/excretes to the skin over 1000mcg of Androstadienone per day!

That is a huge amount. More than the other big 3, I'll try to find the post where I read it and reference this.

So it boggles me about how Androstadienone can be depressing, seeing how men churn it out in such high amounts every day. If you get get a whole bunch of guys together we should all break down and cry, not play sports. Wait, this could be a correlary, maybe those are the guys that Androstadienone causes depression in, the ones who are also have a natural aversion to sports/locker rooms/ other guys.

I'm not sure if I was joking about that or not (the sports thing).

Please share the article if you find it. I'll be interested in reading.