All of the moral defenses I've read here seem quite weak. My thought on morality of pheromones is that it doesn't make anyone do anything they don't WANT to do. Yes, it sometimes changes what some people want. Don't lie to yourself. You wouldn't be using them if they didn't. But it's not like a drug where the girl wakes up the next morning thinking, "Oh God!"

People are against pheromones because they can't process the idea that there's something that influences what we want without us knowing it. People buy into the American Dream modern myth hook-line-and-sinker that we choose what we want out of the bottom of our hearts and then make it happen in our lives by ourselves, unaffected by fate, circumstance, biology, social conditioning, or countless other factors beyond our control that affect how we think and feel.

So I think it's not really a moral issue, so much as something that is dissonant with a conventional way of viewing the world and how people view themselves. This is why pheromone enthusiasts are almost always free thinkers with open minds and counter-cultural attitudes.

A related issue is the "right or wrongness" of pheromones. And this is not so much the question of, "Is it evil to use pheromones?" as the question of, "Is it a good idea to use pheromones?" To that I would say that if you NEED pheromones to be happy and function socially, or if it causes you to lead a double life that disrupts your intimate relationships, you have a disease, probably physical in nature but manifesting in the psychological, that needs some kind of treatment. Pheromones cannot resolve this, and they can't cause this either.. Of course, these people usually become quite frustrated with the nature of pheromones and weed themselves out, as it's been suggested.

I give NP17 100% credit, people also buy expensive cars and ralph lauren clothing to be more attractive

The part that would be considered immoral is if your intention were to take advantage of people with your pheromones as if it were a kind of drug. The fact that most of us don;t share that we use pheromones comes to mind, because pheromones DO affect the way people behave, and i'm fairly certain that a handful of people would not like it if they knew you had pheromones on and it were affecting the way they think. So, yeah - its a judgement call on your part. Its all in how you think of and use pheromones. I do have some fun from time to time to see how people will react and I do think of it as a secret weapon so to speak, but then again I am aware that my success with pheromones is based on my actions; how I act while I wear them. so... take it for what its worth.

there is a certain unknown to neurosteroids. we have to accept that humans ultimately bear responsibility for their front lobe. the real concern would be the absorption channels and potential side effects short and long term.

for instance, can they stimulate or depress the nervous system. can they impede or accelerate sexual development, can they trigger chain effects or accelerate natural hormone output in negative or positive ways...

there a substances that be added to perfumes that produce chemical reactions inside the body at picogram levels. there are also unknown effects from bioaccumulation.

one could argue that while is it ethically okay to experiment on yourself, exposing someone to substances as a by-product is unethical and especially so if you are trying to manipulate behavior at the biological level.

does the lack of scientific proof of a danger still make ethical? since proving long term effects is virtually non-existent.

is McDonald's ethical for doing the same thing with food? The difference here is that one participant is exposed similar to cigarette smoke.

What if we were to find out that an ingredient my trigger abnormal development in children or trigger mutations that give rise to inflammatory breast cancer?

Lots of if's.

Until something is proven, I am continuing my experiments since I am still not convinced entirely that the substances have long term effects. Can I sue my uber driver for using air freshner?

But I will say that if these are just behavioral triggers, I put them into acceptable ethical territory.

Thread with this topic already got closed,so don't dig up old garbage.Want to discuss morality, join a religious forum or join feminist cult and be their beta white knight.

(10-27-2016 2:20 AM)jb20 Wrote:  Thread with this topic already got closed,so don't dig up old garbage.Want to discuss morality, join a religious forum or join feminist cult and be their beta white knight.

Arsenic and Jimmycrack made reasonable posts with interesting points about ethics and pheromones. You have intruded with an insult which would derail a conversation that was reasonable prior to your intrusion. If you don't like the conversation, your participation is not required or invited, and others can continue it. If you don't like someone's position, please attack the position, not the person: threads get shut down because people are behaving badly, not because they disagree.

(10-27-2016 2:20 AM)jb20 Wrote:  Thread with this topic already got closed,so don't dig up old garbage.Want to discuss morality, join a religious forum or join feminist cult and be their beta white knight.

seems like there's a lot of BW testers lately ... lol

(10-27-2016 1:15 PM)Spider-mone Wrote:  seems like there's a lot of BW testers lately ... lol

Ha Ha!

(10-27-2016 12:42 PM)BarefootOxford Wrote:  Arsenic and Jimmycrack made reasonable posts with interesting points about ethics and pheromones. You have intruded with an insult which would derail a conversation that was reasonable prior to your intrusion. If you don't like the conversation, your participation is not required or invited, and others can continue it. If you don't like someone's position, please attack the position, not the person: threads get shut down because people are behaving badly, not because they disagree.

I was simply sating that, arguing about ethics & moral about mones is useless.Because,there are better topics:is it ethical to buy mones instead of donating to charity, because people are starving to death because of poverty? Ethical to drink milk because cows produce milk for its calves ? Ethical to eat meat because animals feel pain ?Ethical to wear makeup,push up bras,use Photoshop or women telling they like nice guys when they clearly don't?Ethical to wash your natural mones by showering?Buying good clothes,a good car,getting a good job,being alpha because they influence women?etc.It is a matter of time before some troll flame this thread that is the main reason for my response.No where in my response I insulted anyone.
"If you don't like the conversation, your participation is not required or invited, and others can continue it. If you don't like someone's position, please attack the position, not the person"-Throwing a hissy fit and telling people to shut up, you are doing the same...oh irony.Maybe we need a safe space.

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(10-27-2016 1:15 PM)Spider-mone Wrote:  seems like there's a lot of BW testers lately ... lol

(10-27-2016 4:21 PM)jb20 Wrote:  I was simply sating that, arguing about ethics & moral about mones is useless.Because,there are better topics:is it ethical to buy mones instead of donating to charity, because people are starving to death because of poverty? Ethical to drink milk because cows produce milk for its calves ? Ethical to eat meat because animals feel pain ?Ethical to wear makeup,push up bras,use Photoshop or women telling they like nice guys when they clearly don't?Ethical to wash your natural mones by showering?Buying good clothes,a good car,getting a good job,being alpha because they influence women?etc.It is a matter of time before some troll flame this thread that is the main reason for my response.No where in my response I insulted anyone.
"If you don't like the conversation, your participation is not required or invited, and others can continue it. If you don't like someone's position, please attack the position, not the person"-Throwing a hissy fit and telling people to shut up, you are doing the same...oh irony.Maybe we need a safe space.

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Nonsense. You did not simply state any of that. Are you saying that telling people to go be a "beta white knight" elsewhere is intended with "Good feelings"? Perhaps calling my text a hissy fit and making a reference to a safe space is also intended with brotherly love and the spirit of philosophy. If so, you've missed the mark.